Greek and Turkish music thread

[Adam Blake]

What on earth is the time signature on this? I can't fathom it. Same goes for the other version, the one with Pans People.

9 - 4

[Rob Hall]

Thanks Adam. Would it be imprudent to ask why? (That is, why would a culture develop such a time signature; despite the efforts of the young ladies in the clip, who seem able to jiggle up and down to it, it's hardly toe-tapping is it?)

[Adam Blake]

Thanks Adam. Would it be imprudent to ask why?

Of course not. But do you mean why or how? How: it's one bar of 4 - 4 followed by a bar of 5 - 4 which rotates. The four is split 2 plus 2 as usual in Western music, the five is, I think, split 3 plus 2 - but it may be the other way round, I'd have to put it under the microscope a bit more thoroughly to be certain.

Why? Who knows? Ethno-musicology, man, ethno-musicology. Eastern European music is full of odd numbers. This one just moves very slowly. Usually it flies past so fast you could almost count the "one" of each bar as a beat.

("Everything is in 4-4" - Ginger Baker.
I don't agree with the old curmudgeon on this, by the way, but it's a point of view. )

[Rob Hall]

Thanks again. I meant why, but suspecting that it might lead into ethnomusical (ethnomusicological?) areas that I wouldn't be able to understand anyway. As you say, it probably helps if it is taken slowly, but I struggled to find any natural empathy with the rhythm - fascinating though it is - and wondered if it might be a cultural thing; that is, people from a different culture might struggle less.

[Adam Blake]

It's totally a cultural thing. When I was trying to learn about Indian music it was a fascinating lightbulb moment for me when I realised that they teach all the rhythms, from 2's on up, at the same level. There is no perceived complexity or simplicity. They are just different. That's philosophy for you. It's great because it works. A classically trained Indian musician sees no difficulty in thinking in 7's or 15's any more than 4's. They're just different.

I remember doing a gig with a bunch of North African musicians and asking them why all their songs were in 6 - 8 time. They just smiled and said, "that's the way the camel walks". Of course it is! Camels walk in 6 -8 time. Duh....

Eastern European folk music is some wacky shit, though. I have no idea where those combinations of 2's, 3's and 4's come from. Ivo Papasov's rhythms makes Captain Beefheart's sound like four to the floor.

[Willy]

Here's my current straight-in-at-number-one favourite song. Yuksek Yuksek Teplere by Candan Ercetin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MP0jS3Y1Rks

What on earth is the time signature on this? I can't fathom it. Same goes for the other version, the one with Pans People.

This one gets better every time I play it, Cheers Gordon.
Didn't even notice the weird timing til now, only that the vocals reminds me of "Never Turn your Back on Mother Earth" which is nice.

One-two-Cut-your-Hair!

[Gordon Neill]

Willy said:
[Yuksek Yuksek Teplere by Candan Ercetin.]This one gets better every time I play it...didn't even notice the weird timing til now.

I liked this the first time heard it. With me it usually is love at first sound. But, like you, it just gets better and better for me. It seems so simple, but so profound.

As for the informed discussion between Rob and Adam, I'm trying not to read the explanations. I feel like a child who doesn't want a magic trick explained. I just want to stay innocent and easily amused. Not that I would understand it anyway...

Judith confessed:

I've always shared your taste in gloomy feeling songs.

OK, here's another jaunty litle number! 'Kavaklar' by Sezen Aksu. I think it's from quite early in her career. And, because it has quite a different feel from most of her stuff, I suspect it's a traditional song. but I'm guessing. I've no idea what it's about, but wallow in the misery! Here's the studio version, with a video of a photograph: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZ8rvngVeQ8

Here's a shortened live version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdLCAUOB07U

[Gordon Neill]

...but, in a continuing effort to lower the tone, here's something a bit perkier from Goksel, called 'Karar Verdim'. [Apologies in advance about the idiotic advert at the start]. Listening to her voice, it almost sounds like an orgasm set to music. [Apologies in retrospect for idiotic comment].
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEBk0mOhm4M

[kastamonu]

Slipping in a bit of rap from Sagopa Kajmer here (what a name, what a voice!)
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xajmc1 ... ge-under-4

Sezen Aksu - beautiful song (music by Onno Tunç - Armenian Turkish and both her friend & partner for some years - he died tragically in a plane crash, she was said to have suffered badly with depression after this)

Love the Goksel!
(Will attempt another fave of hers following this post) 'Depresyondayim' - fab!
Thank you all for the explanations about timings - can't begin to understand it all - just enjoying all the great music on here!

[kastamonu]

Goksel

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xbsm3_ ... rel-page-1

[kastamonu]

And that was fairly gloomy too! ;-)

[Willy]

And that was fairly gloomy too! ;-)

Here is a English subtitled version of same song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtDdxGGhv6s

'Fraid I couln't take that one seriously, like it for the "low key" guitar though and happily some kind person helps her out of the wardrobe -Good times!

[kastamonu]

Ha ha thanks Willy. Well of course this is just pop but I agree it doesn't translate at all well!!!! The Turkish food in the video looks fairly fab tho' - I like her voice, she's popular here & maybe some of her other stuff is a bit better!

Tarkan's for me - many won't agree - here he goes!

http://www.google.com.tr/url?sa=t&rct=j ... 9hfeEJGhGw

He does traditional stuff well too - mega-star here - love him!

[debbie golt]

Just adding to this thread encouraging you to discover Terryazoome at www.terryazoome.com who play Greek infused jazz ... or jazz infused greek music with a taste of afro thrown in . I have listed their gig in the live strand - however no harm in plugging here too!

If you go to www.eugreeka.com you can hear an interview with Terry Hunt the founder at 03:00, 11:00. 19:00 and 22:00 this week

and they are recently reviewed by Rich Rainlore on his imitable Rainlore's World of Music site see -- http://www.rainloresworldofmusic.net/Re ... -Xana.html

and their music is also on www.terryazoome.com

[kastamonu]

Her latest (I like & keep singing...)

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG7kbD ... uTutipqXjo

Not a wardrobe in site :) but plenty of tragedy & drama here - I DO like her voice though...